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Scott McCullochUser is Offline
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9/25/2005 6:03 AM  

The following are my crib notes on upcoming features for Subscription Tools and a change in design from the core implementation.

Feel free to comment on various features and the proposed implementation; I’m still deciding if belonging to multiple subscriptions at the same time is important? (It isn’t for my site, but maybe for yours it is)

Change in Subscription Features

Currently, this site uses PayPal subscriptions, something which DotNetNuke supports out of the box (kind of).

The main problem with PayPal subscriptions is that it’s auto-billing, as a consumer I hate this model! I don’t like to be auto-billed when my subscription is runs out (you can mark your subscription as active or non-active), but people sometimes forget to do that and billing becomes a nightmare.

The right model is a pay as you go system. When someone pays for access to your site, they gain access to your site for the specified period (e.g. 3 months, 1 year). By default, the subscription is not auto-renewing and the user will be given the option to renew their membership (either close to expiration or after expiration).

I like this method because the user remains completely control. Payment processor’s such as paypal, 2checkout, etc remain just a payment processor (so it is easier to add more).

A good example of this method is www.clipart.com.

Subscription Tools Design

There is one theme that I want to keep in all my modules (some don’t adhere to this theme) is that it should be simple to use. So when designing these extensions I had to keep this theme in mind.

An additional module, subscription module will be added to the subscription tools package.

Subscription Module (View Control)

This module will prompt the user with information about there subscription. Each bullet point is a separate area in the module.

If a user is anonymous:-

  • You must login message. (later will have an integration registration module)

If a user is not a subscriber:-

  • Signup Options
    • Select a Plan – Radio Button (Plans, e.g. 1 year for $35)
    • Select a Payment Processor – (PayPal, 2Checkout, etc)
  • Previous Payments (if applicable, invisible if not)
    • Lists Date/Processor/Plan/Status (Status includes such things as if the payment is uncleared, expecting clearance on XXX date)

If a user is a subscriber:-

  • Renew Options
    • Message on when current plans the user belongs to and when it expires (or if it has expired)
    • Select a Current (or expired) Plan to renew/extend
    • Change Plan Option?
    • Select a Payment Processor – (PayPal, 2Checkout, etc)
  • Previous Payments (if applicable, invisible if not)
    • Lists Date/Processor/Plan/Status (Status includes such things as if the payment is uncleared, expecting clearance on XXX date)

Edit Subscriptions (Edit Control)

  • Grid to allow the administrator to create new subscriptions.

Edit Processors (Edit Control)

  • Grid to add new processors (will be populated from a list of providers). The admin will enable what processors they want to support. (just paypal to begin with)

Subscription View Options (Edit Control)

  • Ability to change admin options as “Use Development Paypal Server”

So, these are the next range of enhancements, feel free to ask questions and offer suggestions on what might be changed (and what you use it for).

 

 


Scott McCulloch
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brianUser is Offline
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9/26/2005 9:13 AM  

Sounds perfect..   what is the time schedule for this?

Should also be easy to add in an additional feature..  to create a new portal (parent or child, etc.).  

If you are interested.. I would be willing to subsidize this project to get in done asap. 

Ray KuyvenhovenUser is Offline
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9/26/2005 11:31 AM  
"I’m still deciding if belonging to multiple subscriptions at the same time is important? (It isn’t for my site, but maybe for yours it is)"

While I currently don't have a need for multiple subscriptions, a couple ideas I've been thinking about would require this.

Scenerio 1 -  website provides information in a number of different categories. users would be able subscribe to any of the categories they have an interest in.

Scenerio 2 - website provides a base service with a number of add-on services.


Ray

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Dax DavisUser is Offline
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9/26/2005 6:52 PM  
I think having the ability to subscribe to multiple levels or packages is a good idea.  I have clients that offer a membership level then have special add on services.

Dax
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10/05/2005 7:57 AM  
Sounds good Scott - I also don't like charging my subscribers on a recurring basis, but the current DNN core doesn't allow you to have a one time fee with a set expiry date.

I look forward to this module!

Thanks
Rodney
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Tamara BrownUser is Offline
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10/06/2005 8:27 AM  
I’m still deciding if belonging to multiple subscriptions at the same time is important? (It isn’t for my site, but maybe for yours it is)

Yes, I need this feature. My first site using this tool has multiple sub levels. I'm using it to manage payments made to a home owner's association - 3 a year.

 

 



Scott McCullochUser is Offline
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10/06/2005 8:34 AM  
Posted By tbrown on 6/10/2005 8:27:58 AM
I’m still deciding if belonging to multiple subscriptions at the same time is important? (It isn’t for my site, but maybe for yours it is)

Yes, I need this feature. My first site using this tool has multiple sub levels. I'm using it to manage payments made to a home owner's association - 3 a year.

 

 

Your users would belong to multiple subscriptions at the same time?




Scott McCulloch
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Joe BrazellUser is Offline
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10/06/2005 8:57 AM  

I would vote for having the multiple subscription options.  We would like to have multiple categories that people could subscribe to at one time.  Basically, a main subscription with additional opt-in packages.

Just my two cents worth
Joe Brazell


Joe
Tamara BrownUser is Offline
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10/06/2005 9:04 AM  
Yes. My members have a bi-annual (6 months) pymt, a once a year tax pymt (separate category), and possible maintenance fees. Each is handled different as there are different legal obligations. But I use the sub tools to grant access to the site and update a reminder message on the home page.
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10/06/2005 9:13 AM  
I have another secnerio for a bike shop with a club. Members may be standard registered users, belong to paid club and also some may be members of the racers team which is more $ but is given access to more pages. Membership length of the club and race team are different.
Alessio MorgantiUser is Offline
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10/06/2005 9:19 AM  
Hi,

Another features that i hope you like:

  • Trial time before payment request
  • Edit Packages to sell (Edit Control)

    • Grid to allow the administrator to manage subscription offer trades them, with the price.

  •  Administrative check on the subscriptions in expiration.

Alessio


Alessio Morganti
Scott McCullochUser is Offline
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10/06/2005 4:45 PM  
Posted By tbrown on 6/10/2005 9:13:22 AM
I have another secnerio for a bike shop with a club. Members may be standard registered users, belong to paid club and also some may be members of the racers team which is more $ but is given access to more pages. Membership length of the club and race team are different.



is the racers a superset of a club? e.g. a user would most likely be either a club or racer?

My scenario for this site is that you can be silver or gold, the only difference is the duration. I see the need to support both scenario's though, maybe a config switch because I want to make the module easy to understand for people signing up.


Scott McCulloch
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10/06/2005 4:46 PM  
Posted By theorangejuice on 6/10/2005 9:19:51 AM
Hi,

Another features that i hope you like:

  • Trial time before payment request
  • Edit Packages to sell (Edit Control)

    • Grid to allow the administrator to manage subscription offer trades them, with the price.

  •  Administrative check on the subscriptions in expiration.

Alessio


The trial time sounds good, as well as the admin check. Actually there will be a procedure to email users that have subscriptions expiring in X days.

What do you mean by edit packages to sell?


Scott McCulloch
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10/06/2005 11:22 PM  

I'm referring to the choice of the plan.

Remaining with a one-to-one association between roles and plan, with a edit control the administrator can manage the plans: Destription, Fee and Trial price, Duration.

It's only an idea ...

Bye

Alessio


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10/07/2005 7:09 AM  
Posted By theorangejuice on 6/10/2005 11:22:29 PM

I'm referring to the choice of the plan.

Remaining with a one-to-one association between roles and plan, with a edit control the administrator can manage the plans: Destription, Fee and Trial price, Duration.

It's only an idea ...

Bye

Alessio


I had originally planned the module like that, but I wanted to have the least amount of dependance on the core role structure.

Scott McCulloch
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Mark ODonnellUser is Offline
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10/20/2005 12:18 PM  

Excuse my butting in..   I had a question about the subscription tools ability to set dates.
For example is the tool smart enough to know that if a registered member decides to subscribe for 1 year, 2 months, 6 months, 30 days, or 16 days will the module automatically set the expiration date?

Thanks

Scott McCullochUser is Offline
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10/21/2005 6:48 PM  
Posted By simonduz on 10/20/2005 12:18 PM

Excuse my butting in..   I had a question about the subscription tools ability to set dates.
For example is the tool smart enough to know that if a registered member decides to subscribe for 1 year, 2 months, 6 months, 30 days, or 16 days will the module automatically set the expiration date?

Thanks



Yep, plus give reminders through screens on where there period is up

Scott McCulloch
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Shad PulleyUser is Offline
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10/26/2005 9:32 AM  
Scott,

I'm glad to see what you're doing with your modules.  I custom wrote a subscription based system for my classic asp site.  It's a web site about model trains.  http://www.mylargescale.com  I've been looking to move to a DNN based solution, but membership management has always been a question, along with all the other custom applications I have written around my snitz forum database. 

Your direction is exactly the way I went.  I tried paypal subscriptions, but when you're doing things for 1 year at a time, it makes it a pain in the arse.  People's cards are expiring, they forget that they signed up and you get hatemail because they got a charge on their card, etc.  I abandoned that and went to the policy of making people renew each year.  It works well.

I have a few suggestions for your module:

If possible, have a process that sends out renewal reminder emails at configurable intervals.  Right now, I manually send out emails, but if I could configure to send reminders out at 60, 30, 14, 7, and 1 days, I'd do it in a heartbeat and would keep things going. 

Automatically expiring after a certain configurable number of days would be nice.  I usually give my members a 30 day grace period.  After that, their account is deactivated and the membership benefits are taken away.

Also, is there a way to make fields in the member profile required upon upgrading?  If I want to upgrade to Gold on your site, is there a way you could make me enter my address information?  I would need this kind of functionality, as I mail information and a membership id card to use for discounts and such to my upgraded members.  It would be nice to require configurable profile fields to be populated before a subscription could be purchased.

Multiple levels or add ons would be nice.  One thing I offer to my members is space on my server to store photos etc..  I sell additional space to members who request it, but I currently have no way of tracking who has it and when they've paid other than with an excel spreadsheet on my computer.  It would be nice to have that billed with the membership and have them added to an additional group so I can automatically give them the room they are paying for.

Thanks for seeing the need for these typ of modules..  I'm going to upgrade my membership here right now..

Shad

Shad Pulley
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RionUser is Offline
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10/26/2005 11:20 AM  

Any update on when this might be ready?

 

Thanks,
Rion

Scott McCullochUser is Offline
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10/26/2005 5:24 PM  
Posted By SPulley on 10/26/2005 9:32 AM
Scott,

I'm glad to see what you're doing with your modules.  I custom wrote a subscription based system for my classic asp site.  It's a web site about model trains.  http://www.mylargescale.com  I've been looking to move to a DNN based solution, but membership management has always been a question, along with all the other custom applications I have written around my snitz forum database. 

Your direction is exactly the way I went.  I tried paypal subscriptions, but when you're doing things for 1 year at a time, it makes it a pain in the arse.  People's cards are expiring, they forget that they signed up and you get hatemail because they got a charge on their card, etc.  I abandoned that and went to the policy of making people renew each year.  It works well.

I have a few suggestions for your module:

If possible, have a process that sends out renewal reminder emails at configurable intervals.  Right now, I manually send out emails, but if I could configure to send reminders out at 60, 30, 14, 7, and 1 days, I'd do it in a heartbeat and would keep things going. 

Automatically expiring after a certain configurable number of days would be nice.  I usually give my members a 30 day grace period.  After that, their account is deactivated and the membership benefits are taken away.

Also, is there a way to make fields in the member profile required upon upgrading?  If I want to upgrade to Gold on your site, is there a way you could make me enter my address information?  I would need this kind of functionality, as I mail information and a membership id card to use for discounts and such to my upgraded members.  It would be nice to require configurable profile fields to be populated before a subscription could be purchased.

Multiple levels or add ons would be nice.  One thing I offer to my members is space on my server to store photos etc..  I sell additional space to members who request it, but I currently have no way of tracking who has it and when they've paid other than with an excel spreadsheet on my computer.  It would be nice to have that billed with the membership and have them added to an additional group so I can automatically give them the room they are paying for.

Thanks for seeing the need for these typ of modules..  I'm going to upgrade my membership here right now..

Shad



Some of these features wouldn't be available in the first release (e.g. required fields on upgrading)

Reminder emails will likely be a scheduled job in the scheduler, so you can schedule it whenever it send out the emails.

I'll take a look at your site, I might get some ideas


Scott McCulloch
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